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Subject: Groups - DITA TC Meeting Minutes 7 February 2023 uploaded
- From: Nancy Harrison<nharrison@infobridge-solutions.com>
- To: <dita@lists.oasis-open.org>
- Date: Wed, 8 Feb 2023 23:05:08 +0000 (UTC)
Submitter's message
ActionItems: Review troubleshooting
=================================================
Minutes of the OASIS DITA TC
Tuesday, 7 February 2023
Recorded by Hancy Harrison
link to agenda for this meeting:
https://wiki.OASIS-open.org/dita/PreviousAgendas
Attendance:
===========
Bill Burns, Tammy Crowley, Stan Doherty, Kris Eberlein, Nancy Harrison, Eliot Kimber, Zoe Lawson, Keith Schengili-Roberts, Eric Sirois, Dawn Stevens, Kathryn Torriano, Frank Wegmann, Todd Thorner, Jim Tivy
Business
========
1. Roll call
Regrets: Robert Anderson
2. Approve minutes from previous business meeting:
31 January 2023
https://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/dita/202302/msg00001.html (Harrison, 04 February 2023)
Kris moved, 2nd Keith, approved by TC
3. Announcements - none
4. Action items and volunteer tasks
[updates only; se agenda for complete list]
10 January 2023
Eliot: Suggest examples and new wording re "Cascading attribute values"
- Eliot; haven't been able to get to that yet.
17 January 2023
Tammy & Kathryn: Estimates for when inital editing of release management & bookmap topics will be completed COMPLETED
5. Report from LwDITA subcommittee
- Frank; since we didn't meet yesterday, probably better if we postpose this report to 2 weeks from now; there have been a bunch of online discussions, but we should have stuff wrapped up by then.
- Kris; ok
6. Technical content review C: Programming, software, and UI doma
https://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/dita/202301/msg00005.html (Anderson, 09 January 2023)
Status of review
Participation: Eliot, Kris, Robert, Tammy, Zoe, Stan, Bill, Frank, Nancy
Update (Anderson)
[held over till Robert is here]
7. Techical content review D: Hardware, markup, and XML mention domains
Opening of review
https://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/dita/202301/msg00021.html (Eberlein, 24 January 2023)
Status of review
Participation: Kris, Robert, Zoe, Stan, Dawn, Frank, Nancy
Update (Anderson)
[held over till Robert is here]
8. Base review T: utilities domain and sorting
https://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/dita/202301/msg00030.html (Eberlein, 30 January 2023)
Questions from review:
https://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/dita/202302/msg00002.html (Eberlein, 07 February 2023)
- Kris; wrt review questions; you must have a shape element, but it can be empty. It can take four values, or it can be empty; if it's empty, it gets the default value 'rect.'
- Nancy; so it seems to be generally based on HTML, and if so, but with this exception, we should note it.
- Kris; but there are a lot of parts of DITA that are based on HTML but slightly different, and we don't do that for other places, e.g., where we use elements instead of @s the way HTML does it. Does anyone remember the thinking about this (from way back in 1.0, so 20 years ago...
[no one who was there then - Stan, Eliot, Nancy - remembers]
- Eliot; I do remember that the use of elements instead of @s was a general DITA principle.
- Kris; we want to be careful when we revise this so that we don't stray too much from what was in the 1.3 map. Also, creation of imagemaps is pretty GUI-ified. Nancy, do you want a statement?
- Nancy; well, if it's a general thing, maybe we need a general statement...
- Kris; and dawn, were your questions clarified? For coords, if you say 'default' for shape, then coords should be empty, and processors might ignore values in coords if they exist, or output an info or error message.
- Tammy; so if you want the entire image, set shape to 'default' and leave coords empty.
- Dawn; if I leave shape empty, a rect is assumed and requires coords. If i say 'default', then entire image is taken, and I don't need to put values in coords element.
- Kris; we should have another example in imagemap, where shape is 'default' and no coords specified. The reason you don't need coords values in that case is that the coords are given by the image itself.
[Stan, Eliot, and Bill have all used imagemaps; Bill's company built their own imagemap editor.]
- Nancy; and what about general HTML issues?
- Kris; I'd prefer to leave that till Robert is back, since it's a more general question.
- Kris; OK, so on to sorting. There are 2 suggested changes for sorting,
1) that it be slightly more precise; using 'prepended to' rather than 'combined with'
2) change to suggested shortdesc
- Kris; Eliot, do you have preferences?
- Eliot; wrt 'prepended' vs. 'combined', the details of how things get combined is an implementation detail.
- Kris; but we actually have normative text around it being prepended.
- Eliot; then it's probably best to be consistent.
- Kris; I don't like the spec telling people their implementation details, but we did it for 1.3.
- Eliot; if it's already treading on implementation details, then it's probably not worth changing it now.
- Kris; not hearing
- Tammy; when you use sort-as, do you always supply text?
- Kris; you could supply either the content of sort-as element, or the @value of the sort-as element.
- Tammy; also, I'm assuming sort-as is included, never stands on its own?
- Eliot; it's always contained in the element to be sorted, e.g. a list.
9. Review E: Troubleshooting
https://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/dita/202302/msg00005.html (Eberlein, 07 February 2023)
- Kris; I opened this just before call; all standard review stuff applies. Once you got on CF, you'll see that the elements don't appear in correct order; for some reason I couldn't control their order. so please start with PDF, then go to CF, and please don't comment on CF order.
- Eliot; we discovered in ServiceNow the same thing for the CF review we did here; we couldn't fix the order either.
- Stan; might be a crossover sort-as issue.... :-)??
- Kris; just wondering, who uses troubleshooting?
- Dawn; my clients use it a lot.
- Keith; I did, but no longer do so much.
- Stan; we use it.
- Kris; what's new for 2.0 is the addition of the diagnostics component. And we're updating a CN for troubleshooting. One was originally done by Bob Thomas, but it's no longer really applicable.
- Tammy; I have question about examples, for troubleshooting and in general. I would have put troubleshoolution block within troubleshooting body. when we have elements that are contained, my pref would be to show that relationship? to provide more context.
- Kris; we didn't want, for all of troubleshooting element to see the whole topic. In general, we haven't had complete containment hierarchy within an example; here, we'd need entire topic. When there are other items required in troublebody; there's a question of how much markup we want to show. For some examples, we've snipped content; we don't want a codeblock that runs over a page in PDF.
- Tammy; I agree, but I have a question of how much context we need.
- Kris; let's hold this over till Robert is present; we can take this up next week. We could compare this eample with an expanded version; we may be deep enough into 2.0 review that we don't want to revisit things we've already reviewed.
10. Editorial work on DITA for Technical Content 2.0 element-reference topics
Editorial assignments, deadlines, review maps
https://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/dita/202301/msg00035.html (Eberlein, 31 January 2023)
Editorial guidelines
https://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/dita/202301/msg00036.html (Eberlein, 31 January 2023)
General resources:
Recording of 20 December 2022 session
https://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/dita/202212/msg00033.html
GitHub education that the TC did in 2018
https://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/dita/202212/msg00034.html (Eberlein, 21 December 2022)
Status?
- Nancy; I've been sick, I'll need to push it out one week.
- Stan; on target.
- Frank; not ready but looked into it, think I should be fine by next week.
- Bill; I finished my passes.
- Keith; aiming to work on it this weekend.
- Tammy; on release mgmt, I still have examples to work on; I don't have status for bookmap.
12 noon ET close
-- Ms. Nancy Harrison
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